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Yandards' 16vG60

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by mrbeige on Thu Aug 26, 2010 12:51 pm

So what's the story then Yan?

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Fri Aug 27, 2010 5:31 am

Not much really, I got back from BVF eventually, parked it in the garage, went on holiday for 3 weeks and then gave it a wash a couple of weeks ago.

Not really sure what to do with it right now, the ECU package I bought would be much more suited to an ABF set-up as it would basically be a plug and go afair using the VR6 style ECU loom connector. So longer term that has to be the way it goes really.

As for now I need to get the head off and do some serious bore honing as well as changing all the bearings, shouldn't take more than a weekend but it's not something I am looking forward to doing. Worst part is dropping the crank out - I suspect it will be easier to just pull the block out rather than try and split the box in the garage.

I did manage to find a guy on ebay who will supply some Mahle made bearings for £50 + VAT and postage, way cheaper than VW and OE spec items to boot.

Just need a little motivation and it's not there right now....

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by mrbeige on Fri Aug 27, 2010 5:40 am

I guess taking a hit like that after all that work is fairly depressing.

If you've got to drop the crank out and indeed the pistons, I think it will be much easier to do that with the block out of the car.

When you go ABF, how are you going to lower the compression? Forged pistons? If you wanted to keep 'standard' rods, you could get some 2E items as they are stonger than the ABF ones.

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Fri Aug 27, 2010 9:19 am

mrbeige wrote:I guess taking a hit like that after all that work is fairly depressing.

If you've got to drop the crank out and indeed the pistons, I think it will be much easier to do that with the block out of the car.

When you go ABF, how are you going to lower the compression? Forged pistons? If you wanted to keep 'standard' rods, you could get some 2E items as they are stonger than the ABF ones.

Ironically I might just go for stacked head gaskets!

Seems really gash and doesn't fit well with my normal requirements but Badger on club gti is running a turboed ABF putting out a lot of usable power and torque on just stacked head gaskets, it's a reliable car that has been running well for a couple of years so given the extra boost pressure turbos develop it would be fine to do the same on a 16vG60.

I did actually place the order for the bearings after I posted up, it would be good it get it all sorted prior to the winter lay-up and at least then I can look at some of the other jobs over winter like the brake overhaul and rear beam that could do with a good blasting and powder coating.

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by mrbeige on Fri Aug 27, 2010 9:48 am

I've seen quite a few people have good results with stacked gaskets, more often than not on ABFs. Far far cheaper than forged internals.

Glad to hear you have ordered the parts. You need to get it back on the road and drive the bloody thing I think.

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Tue Jan 25, 2011 6:58 am

Poopy, the highs and lows of a bloody long term project.

I am currently in the 'do I use the other KR block' phase today - having doubts about number 4 cylinder. It is in tolerance but is towards the top end of the tolerance and despite my efforts with the honing tool it get wider as it goes up - although we are only talking about 0.06mm wider!

Bloody galvaniser hasn't done my stuff I dropped and had left it in a plastic tub which had filled with water, on top of that someone has nicked all the aluminium bits as well - charger bracket, swing arm and PAS ally bracket so I am pissed off with that. Only noticed today when I was thinking about painting it up so I could swap the charger bracket over when the new tensioner arrives..

Heyho stuff happens but it's always when you seem to be making progress the doubts kick in Smile

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by kevhaywire on Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:35 am

"If there is any doubt, there is no doubt" Wink

One of my favourite quotes from Ronin, and quite true too!

I know all about losing a block so soon after it's build, but the best thing I did was starting over with a new one. It was a real expensive year for me that one, but I'm glad I did it as it's given me many 1000s of smiles per miles since Very Happy

Keep it at Yan. It'll be worth it in the long run!




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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:53 am

kevhaywire wrote:"If there is any doubt, there is no doubt" Wink

One of my favourite quotes from Ronin, and quite true too!

I know all about losing a block so soon after it's build, but the best thing I did was starting over with a new one. It was a real expensive year for me that one, but I'm glad I did it as it's given me many 1000s of smiles per miles since Very Happy

Keep it at Yan. It'll be worth it in the long run!




True enough Kev.

It's just nerves really, I will stay with my original plan which was to check to see if this block was within limits (which it is) hone it, head back on and comp check. If the comp numbers are not around the 12b point then it's time to move onto the original block being machined etc and swap all the bits over. I am not looking forward to having to rip the bloody lot out again though but it will give me chance to tweak some of the things I am not 100% with I guess. Rolling Eyes

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:58 pm

Poopy.

Engine back together post honing, 8 bar accross the board on all 4 (at least its consistant). That's when nicely warmed up too, a quick dribble of oil down number 1 gave me another 1.5b and to confirm the gauge was ok I did a quick check on the G60, 11.5b at about 50 deg C oil temp...

So, dilema time.

Do I persist with this engine a little more, its only been up to temp once since the bores were honed and its not been loaded up at all yet, does it need some load to help the rings bed in some more or am I fighting a losing battle (should be getting around 12b). It fires up to 8 pretty quickly, 2nd revolution is hitting 7b and then its a creap up to 8b by the 6th compression.

Or do I use my original 16v block, send the block off for a damn good honing + bore trueness check, acid clean/dip and get the deck trimmed back by a thou or so?

Finally, do I just bite the bullet buy the bloody ABF I will end with eventually and just swap over the required bits? It's a bit more ghetto with stacked head gaskets but at least I know that the bottom end should be pumping ok.. That also means I can add the aftermarket management at my convinence in the future. This conversion would mean sticking the head gaskets on, fitting the ARP head studs, swapping over the water pump and windage tray and thats about it (aside from all the stuff to make the charger work). That does mean all my expensive bits (S2 pistons, balancing work etc) are not transferable but I do just want the bloody thing to run reliably.

It will be cost based as well, ABF is going to set me back around £400 delivered, I already have new bearings for a 1.8 KR lump and I have no idea how much the engine place in Inverness will charge for a basic clean up of a 4 cylinder block..

50p's welcome Smile

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by boost panda on Sun Jan 30, 2011 3:28 pm

Personally, I'd stick with the new block a little longer. Jumping up to 7b on the second rotation sounds good to me, and I'm sure things will improve whilst it is bedded in some more. I know a lot of people have different answers, but when I had a car with a fresh 16v I babied it for 1000miles and then it was bulletproof. I know Kev will probs says give it beans from the off! Very Happy
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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:26 am

boost panda wrote:Personally, I'd stick with the new block a little longer. Jumping up to 7b on the second rotation sounds good to me, and I'm sure things will improve whilst it is bedded in some more. I know a lot of people have different answers, but when I had a car with a fresh 16v I babied it for 1000miles and then it was bulletproof. I know Kev will probs says give it beans from the off! Very Happy

Indeed, its got be worth a bit of time to see if it improves but I would expect it to be better than it is already..

No decent information about best ways to run an engine in or when to do a comp test and what you should get - very conflicting info out there!!!

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by Yandards on Wed Feb 02, 2011 1:30 pm

Got comp, I managed to put in the inlet cam in 1 tooth behind the exhaust cam.

****.. Smile

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Re: Yandards' 16vG60

Post by boost panda on Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:28 pm

happens to the best of us mate.

keep us updated.

p.s. glad you persevered too :-)
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