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Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by dirtytorque on Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:06 pm

And didn't "the wire" use is for a while too ?

From what I have heard u can't miss with it if you want a safe and reliable plug and play solution.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Wed Jul 15, 2009 1:20 pm

Have you decided yet Mic?

With reference to 02M gearboxes....found this on CF earlier .....

C2Motorsports 02M 2 Wheel Drive Conversion Plate

C2Motorsports 02M Gearbox Mount

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Thu Jul 16, 2009 3:54 am

Decided on what? You know me Stu I change my mind every 5 mins about this project! Laughing

As it stands I've got a full PWR chargecooler setup and Emerald ECU in the pipeline, plus Graham is trying to sort me a Helix clutch.

On the gearbox front I'd love to go 02M but need to do a bit more research into driveshafts etc to make sure it'll all fit ok.
That C2 stuff is nice though isn't it? You have to cut and reweld the gearbox mounting cup though which is a bit of a pain.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:00 am

As far as the the driveshafts are concerned, is it just the driveshaft flanges that are different? 110mm as opposed to the standard 100mm? Dec has an 02J in his Corrado, and I think he needed different flanges. VW Beetle 2.0l springs to mind. I agree the C2 stuff looks good, and UK as well.

So you said you are going for the GT35, but what spec are you looking at?

Does the Emerald support Knock sensing?

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:10 am

I think you need custom driveshafts as they are a different length on the VR to the 4motion. Just adds a bit more expense but should be a far stronger box. It definitely isn't a straight swap for the VR box, plus it's a far amount heavier than the VR box....... it might need to be thought about some more.

I'm going GT35R with a .82 hotside, same as Kevs really except I'll only be running 0.5bar to start with as I'll be needing a little time to get used to driving it. This will be by far the most powerful car I've owned, and certainly the most powerful FWD car I've ever driven so a bit of a learning curve will be required.

Don't think Emerald supports knock sensing but none of the standalone systems do as far as I'm aware.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by nemesis360 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:18 am

Some standalones do offer knock control but setting it up so it works 100% would be another matter

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:25 am

nemesis360 wrote:Some standalones do offer knock control but setting it up so it works 100% would be another matter
Yeah, I've heard the calibration is a black art. My collegue spent 3 weeks in VW South Africa in the test cells trying to help calibrate teh knock sense. The VW engineers ended up spending nearly 4 months just trying to get that right Shocked

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:27 am

Yeah had a long chat with Dave about it the other day when we were talknig about the Emerald ECU's. Sounds like mapping the car on the safe side is really the only practical solution as there are just whay to many variables.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by nemesis360 on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:30 am

Yep its a black art alright!

You will need custom shafts, Proptech are on the next industrial estate from us Mic so that wont be a problem if you decide to go down that route.

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:41 am

Anyone got any idea what the difference in physical weight is between the VR and 4Mo boxes?

And also what the realistic power/torque limits are for both boxes?
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:25 am

I'm not sure on the power limits, but if you treat any box with respect it will last much longer anyway (as you probably know). I'm sure the 02M is much more capable at handling the power though.

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by kevhaywire on Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:46 am

For O2m conversions, your best bet imo are these - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

You won't get 'ready to go' O2M to Corrado conversion shafts that strong and that cheap in this country.

The C2 transfer box plate and rear mount are just copies of dutchdub parts made years ago, but they'll do the job. Better way to do it is use the proper 02M dog bone mount, but either way some welding is involved. Which to be fair, when the engine is out is no biggy.

The O2M does break in turbo applications. 450-500hp in 4WD is enough to shatter the gears quite nicely. In FWD applications, the 02M is massively stronger than the 02A/J, standard v standard. The gears are physically a lot bigger (which adds to the weight as you say Mic) and the casing is more rigid. How much it can handle in FWD is anyone's guess but I've heard of a FWD VRT with an 02M running 700 horse and it broke.

I've been putting 400hp and 350ish torques through my 02A for over 2 years and although it's sounding a bit tired now (loose gear backlash), it's handling it just fine.

The key to all this is very simple - just don't exceed the engine and transmission's limits Laughing That does mean putting up with a paltry 400hp though and not flooring it over bumps in the wet.

Knock sensing - Motec have it, but they're greedy feckers. They include it with the ECU (aswell as DBW, MAF sensing etc etc) but you have to pay to "unlock" these features. My mate had to pay $160 to Motec just to get the wiring information to connect up his DBW pedal.

And just because an ECU has it, doesn't mean it's any good. I have it on good authority the only standalone with decent knock control is Pectel.

Personally I would stay with the 24V's Bosch ME7 and get Vince to map it. I won't be using C2 off the shelf stuff again. I know from personal experience Vince's maps are LOADS better and make more power with less boost! I'm sorry but you cannot beat a proper map done for your specific engine.

Yep, GT3582R is the perfect turbo for a 2.8 24V, that will rock.

At this rate I'll beat you to it Mic and I'm not planning to start until next year Laughing

What are you going to do about the intake? You do know that no 24V short runner will fit in the Corrado don't you? HPA's super sexy intake is a must for me.....so that means modding the slam panel and radiator!

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Fri Jul 17, 2009 5:53 am

kevhaywire wrote:At this rate I'll beat you to it Mic and I'm not planning to start until next year Laughing

What are you going to do about the intake? You do know that no 24V short runner will fit in the Corrado don't you? HPA's super sexy intake is a must for me.....so that means modding the slam panel and radiator!

Haha! No way, mine will be done and running before Christmas......... hopefully

On the short-runner front, Dave has got an idea for one he wants to make for 24vT conversions so I think he'll be using mine as a test bed to create something wonderful in that department. More on that when I know more I guess.

The one thing I have definitely got in my favour on the gearbox front is the fact I've now got 3 VR gearboxes stored away (well you never know do you! Laughing) so if one does go pop I've got another waiting in the wings.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Fri Jul 17, 2009 7:26 am

One of those gearboxes is adorning my bench in the garage....and the 24v engine....*runs off to fit both to Gooney*

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:28 am

mrbeige wrote:One of those gearboxes is adorning my bench in the garage....and the 24v engine....
Not anymore Wink

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The good lady wife's Golf VR
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:15 am

mrbeige wrote:
mrbeige wrote:One of those gearboxes is adorning my bench in the garage....and the 24v engine....
Not anymore Wink

Oh no, have you sold some of my stuff to pay for your seagulling habit? Shocked
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:41 pm

mic_VR wrote:
mrbeige wrote:
mrbeige wrote:One of those gearboxes is adorning my bench in the garage....and the 24v engine....
Not anymore Wink

Oh no, have you sold some of my stuff to pay for your seagulling habit? Shocked
Shhhhhh Suspect

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by kevhaywire on Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:37 am

Spare gearboxes you say? Laughing

Keep me posted on what Dave comes up with!

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Thu Jul 23, 2009 6:03 am

Spare gearboxes indeed Kev, I guess I could part with one if someone desperately needed it............. Wink

Dave filled me and Stu in with his ideas for a short runner to fit without modifying the front panel which sounded very promising so I'm looking forward to seeing what he comes up with.

Hoping to get some stuff ordered from the states as a friend of my parents can get it delivered to him at a US airbase and pay no duty/delivery. Key things being exhaust manifold from ATP and turbo/wastegate.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by kevhaywire on Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:05 am

Well mine is getting a bit noisy / worn sounding, so I might just have purchase a spare from you Very Happy

I'm probably going with the PagParts manifold as it will hopefully site the turbo in the same position as the ATP 12V one does, thereby minimising downpipe reworking - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

The ATP one looks like it might have space issues in a Rado - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

That one is good if you want to run the stock 24V intake, but that can only take 10-12psi reliably. Then it starts ballooning and will crack / split open.

As you'll be short runnering it, I'd go with the PagParts personally. Oh and you'll need your GT35R with this housing as the PP mani is T4 only - [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:23 am

Well if you want a gearbox just let me know, about time I helped you out for a change!

The PagParts one looks good, I'm just thinking with the ATP one I won't need to relocate brake cylinder.
I also assumed the ATP manifold might give a little extra room on the Corrado as the engine bay seems bigger than a mk4, take it I've got that wrong?

Definitely not going standard manifold, because I've got the CoP 24v I can run the PWR closer and keep all the pipework shorter than on a coilpack'd car. Obviously need to think about the heat transfer from being so close to the block but I've got an idea about some shielding for that similar to what they use on old school motorbikes to stop you burning yourself on the exhaust.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by junkie on Sat Jul 25, 2009 1:35 am

Just want to add this, alot of people go on about getting the absolute shortest piperun possible, yes its better but only so long as the chage cooling method is upto the job, so never compromise cooling for shorter pipework.
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by kevhaywire on Mon Jul 27, 2009 9:46 am

Cheers chap, I'll let you know about the gearbox!

The ATP one might work, well, it will with a GT30, I'm just not sure about the 35. Actually, you can get a 35R with a T04e compressor housing (3" inlet, 2" outlet) option, which would soon sort that little problem out.

I have no idea how big MK4 engine bays are tbh, but the Corrado does have some room down by the trans tunnel, so you'll probably be OK.

I also prefer the ATP's wastegate outlet location and the fact you can run T3 or T4 turbine housings.

As for cooling, simple deflection works best I've found. I.e. 500 degrees under my heath robinson steel shields, and no more than 100 degrees above it. Obviously the critical thing is a decent size air gap inbetween.

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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mic_VR on Tue Nov 10, 2009 4:40 am

Man alive! It's been ages since updating this thread. Work work work etc! Laughing

Anyway, update in order I think.

Basically the car has done nothing for the last few months....and I mean absolutely nothing! It's all tucked up in the parents garage waiting for me to find some space to work on it.
On the engine front, it appears that during the various moves the engine has had the sump has managed to be cracked so now need to order a R32 sump and oil pump for that.
On the turbo front, I'm now in a position to start actually ordering parts so with that in mind I'm hoping to have my manifold, turbo, wastegate and diverter value (plus associated fixings) all ordered by the weekend and on the way to me by next week.

It's good to be back in the throws of Corrado modding and I'll try to post updates/pics as soon as anything arrives.

Mic
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Re: Mincy, because only a turbo will do now!

Post by mrbeige on Tue Nov 10, 2009 4:46 am

Oh dear, I hope that the cracked sumpage didn't occur chez moi Sad

Good to here that you are ordering part now whooop!

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