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Maximising weight distribution for handling

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Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mic_VR on Sun Nov 09, 2008 2:43 pm

Right then chaps been having a think about how to get the best out of the corrado on the track.

To quote Evo magazine the VR6 is 'a little nose heavy' and with that in mind I'm thinking about my plan of striping the interior and whether that would actually make the weight distribution worse.

During my conversion I'm planning on relocating the battery to the rear, plus I'll have a charge cooler tank in there, but I'm still not sure what it'll handle like.

Anyone got any views/opinions on the matter?
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by junkie on Sun Nov 09, 2008 3:58 pm

It will make it worse, ideally you need carbon fibre bonnet and maybe wings or a big ICE install back there.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by kevhaywire on Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:10 am

Ideally, the bulk of the weight concentration should be in the middle of the car between the axles.

Best place for batteries and charge cooler tanks would be behind the front passenger seat, or next your seat if binning off the pass seat for track work.

Mine in the rear arm rest was the best compromise for a road car.

If you shift the battery inside, lose the rad fan setup and replace with Spals or Kenlowes etc etc , you'll shift 25-30Kg from the nose, depending on battery size.

Unfortunately the VR6 engine tilts forward rather than backwards, so it will always be a nose led car, but you can still get some good results from it.

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by jmc on Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:31 am

So presumably the CF bonnets that some of us have gone for in the group buy on the Corrado Forum work well for this as well then. If this was combined with relocating the battery then that would be a huge amount of weight being removed from over the front axle.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mrbeige on Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:50 am

Do you not have to be a bit careful not to move too much weight from the front though? I would expect that it would upset the balance of the car if the suspension mechanics have been designed to work with the weight distribution as it is? Would the weight at the front of the car actually aid the traction on the front wheels? I can understand removing the weight on a VR, but wouldn't doing the same on a G60, which is quite a bit lighter, not shift too much weight to the back and thus provoking more under steer?

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by jmc on Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:26 am

Yeah, It'll be a fine balance (as it were). With mine the battery is staying where it is and the bonnet being replaced, therefore losing about 25kg I think from memory. With mine as well, there is a Golf G60 FMIC, and extra litre of oil (from the increased capacity of the cooler and extra pipework), and a separate oil cooler at the front. All relatively small amounts of weight I know, but slung out at the front. It'll be intersting to see if there is a noticable difference in handling.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by Toad on Fri Nov 14, 2008 5:08 am

That's an interesting way of looking at it. Did wonder about haldex helping distribution, as it's low and puts more weight toward the rear. Sadly it does add to the total weight of the car.

I suppose if you were to take weight away from the car, you could then run softer suspension, perhaps again saving weight.

Have you seen the Renault Megan R26.R in this month's EVO?

Not even a stereo in it, that has softer suspension than the "standard" R26 and they rate it brilliantly.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mic_VR on Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:06 pm

Interesting stuff gents, I'll definitely be tracking mine so I'll be thinking about placement of items like charge cooler/battery. I'm also thinking of bining the rear seats (no one ever goes in the back of it) and will be thinking about a roll cage.

This is a more long term plan but I just didn't want to do anything which might have a detrimental effect.

Can you get light weight rads along with the usual spal fans etc?
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by Toad on Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:17 pm

Most of the radiators weight will be the coolant I imagine, so you can't really reduce them. Spals will difinitely help, the standard fan setup is bloody heavy.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by davidwort on Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:44 pm

I'd have thought the fuel tank would make the biggest difference, 70L brimmed to the top is a lot of weight at the rear, what makes the Corrado handle best, a full, half or nearly empty tank?

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by Toad on Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:01 pm

Smile Didn't think of that....

Might be able to get some spal type pusher fans on the cheap... I'll find out if you're interested.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by kevhaywire on Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:03 pm

I find mine is more sure footed with a full tank, but accelerates best with half to 1/4 tank!

That is one thing that bugs me about petrol weight. I always tune the dampers with a full tank, but it gets noticably bouncier as the tank empties!

I can see the value in these ferro fluid dampers now!!

Consistency in all conditions is the hardest thing to get right with these cars.

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mic_VR on Sat Nov 15, 2008 3:44 pm

I guess that's the thing isn't in Kev, it's 6 of one and 1/2 a dozen of the other.

Setting up the car based on every condition is going to be impossible, it's finding the right balance.

Decided I'm going to try it on the track in standard form at Snetterton on Dec 7th. Then we'll see what it's really like.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by dukest on Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:33 pm

hey mic, now mine is finally working as its meant to i'd be pretty interested in a bit of fun on the track.. Smile have you booked particular sessions on the 7th or are you going to decide nearer the time? would be up for coming along!

John

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mic_VR on Mon Nov 17, 2008 6:53 am

dukest wrote:hey mic, now mine is finally working as its meant to i'd be pretty interested in a bit of fun on the track.. Smile have you booked particular sessions on the 7th or are you going to decide nearer the time? would be up for coming along!

John

Hey, you alright John? Nice to see you on here.

I've not decided what to book yet, do you know its a taster session thing on the 7th rather than a full trackday?

Link for all those who might be interested

Originally I was going with some friends but they've pulled out so did think about going to a half day one instead. If you PM me your number I'll give you a call and sort something.

And if others are interested I'm sure we can syncronise ourselves!
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by dukest on Thu Nov 20, 2008 3:47 am

cool, yes was thinking about a half day in the morning somewhere too. theres one at bedford on Nov. 29th or Brands on Dec 14th? let me know if you're up for either of those and maybe we can see if anyone else is interested as a bit of a pre-christmas outing! Smile

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by Toad on Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:08 am

Today whilst mincing around trying to work out how wide a snowplough is, I happened across a single axle weighbridge, so put the 16v on it.

Front axle 780Kg, rear 530 Kg

That is with me in the drivers seat (115Kg) and lots of tools in the boot (30kg) but only 1/4 of a tank of fuel.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by jmc on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:17 am

Wow, its quite a front heavy setup then. I presume the VR would be more so, but the G60 about the same?
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by dirtytorque on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:21 am

Whats the official weight of a raddo?
Was 1260 kg.
I have new 15's now as opposed to the 17's i was running so I need to get it re weighed.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by Toad on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:49 am

Hmmm. Those figures suggest under 1200kg without driver. That doesn't sound quite right. Might have to go back and try again...
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by dirtytorque on Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:56 am

just remembered 1260kg was with me in it.
I think i'm about 85 kg.
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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by ctwg60 on Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:55 pm

1115kg is the User Manual book weight for a Corrado G60. I weighed mine without me in it and less than a gallon of fuel and it was 1120kg

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by mrbeige on Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:03 pm

They might have used the very early models for the book weight probably without elec windows or sunroof. The early models also didn't have side impact protection in the doors..

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by ctwg60 on Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:57 pm

My car has electric windows and sunroof but no sip.

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Re: Maximising weight distribution for handling

Post by davidwort on Mon Nov 24, 2008 2:48 pm

Toad wrote:
Front axle 780Kg, rear 530 Kg
That's about right then, around 1150 for an early 4cyl and about 100Kg more for a VR.

I've managed to lose a couple of brackets from the engine, the subframe weight(will I shake to pieces now?), the adjustable steering column the heavy OEM exhaust and the spare wheel, I'll get my power to weight up one way or another Laughing

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